Mega Suggestion Thread

Setery

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May 29, 2020
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139
This will be a mega thread for kit balancing and other suggestions, pick and choose what you want to talk about, or talk about all of these, I don’t care either way.

KITS

Medic:
-This kit can singlehandedly tilt the balance of a team by existing. When 1 team has no medic or has 1 less medic, they enter a situation called a medic disadvantage. By being in a medic disadvantage, your team is overall less bulky and is a lot less likely to win. I think this can be mitigated with a gui to see what kits people are going. Venom can also force these medic disadvantages.
-Reduce overall healing, the output on this kit is extremely strong, you can effectively save 2-3 players from certain death with a fast regen on the healing pool.
- Heavily reduce healing to Jugg, Burst, and Dwarf, (ignoring burst) these kits have the most effective health meaning that 1 heart of health has more value to them than 1 heart of health to a ghost.


Arbalist:
-I think it needs a very minor nerf to the timer for regening spectral arrows. Just add a few seconds, probably around 5 or so. This kit can have a high damage output and it now doesn’t lose the arrow if it misses.
-Fix the lingering glowing effect bug, this can get invis kits killed really easily and is just legal ESP.

Barricader:
-I’m still not a fan of this kit being mapmaker locked, but I would also not be a fan of this kit being played a ton which it would if everyone could use it. Unlock this kit to all; but apply the following changes.
-Each kill an opponent gets should reduce barricader damage and after 3 kills, remove taking fire when breaking a barricader.

-Reduce the amount of note blocks by 2.

Burst:
-I’ve made a bug report on this kit, but to sum it up, it’s doing too much damage up close and sometimes too little damage from long ranged shots. It’s also doing too much damage with spammed arrows and doing seemingly less with fully charged arrows. If this is fixed, the kit should be better off
-However, I think the damage output is still a little too strong, after all this kit can do approximately 3 hearts (or more) to the average melee armor kit and this damage is aoe. I would prefer to see a reduction in damage, rein in the blast radius, or have stronger falloff of the explosion depending on distance to the arrow.
-Burst should also recieve a power nerf to fall below shortbow for damage.

Dwarf:
-This kit either needs to be removed or….
-If the game has 30 seconds to poison, rapidly lower the dwarf’s level, but no lower than regular iron armor and sharp 1 sword.
-Remove the ability to have players warped *near* a dwarf with about a 8-10 block radius.
-Remove some levels on the dwarf if they use a teleporter, the amount of levels removed is related to the distance traveled. 10 blocks per level may work, but this would need playtesting.

-Apply weakness 1 (it’s -4 attack damage) when teleporting, with the same reasoning as jugg which is below, except this kit gets high offensive power on top of being tanky.


Explosive:
-Reduce the number of grenades that the player can throw out at once. I currently don’t know the number that they can use, please enlighten me so I can give a solid number to this.
-Lower close range RPG damage *or* heavily punish the explosive, as in more damage to the user, if they use an RPG very close to their body. I personally prefer the first over the second as players won’t be punished as hard for approaching a mostly ranged kit and entering close range. It’s very common to see explosives on 25% of their health RPGing last second and somehow still living and getting the kill.

Juggernaut:
-Apply weakness 1 (it’s -4 attack damage, stone sword is 5 attack damage making the jugg have 1 attack damage) for 10 seconds when teleporting. This prevents an extremely tanky kit from moving across the map and immediately entering a fight with players who won’t be able to handle this kit. A stone sword is very good damage with this class and the one thing that this kit is held back by is mobility. If this kit gets teleported, it’s one disadvantage is null. Weakness should help solve this flaw.

Ninja:
-Give regen 1 for 8 seconds on pearl use. This kit is decently frail with little offensive power, but it’s meant to approach players with melee. With regen, this kit can enter the fight again much quicker.

Porcupine:
-Give projectile prot 2 to the chestplate. I feel like this kit was meant to get pelted by arrows and not be phased overall.
-Give knockback reduction to this kit to help counter longbow a bit more.
-Give 2 fire resistance splash pot for 5 seconds to help counter pyro more directly. Yes this kit can splash their own teammates.

Spy:
-Fix their name from appearing at the bottom of the team in tab.

Trigger:
-Buff or fix explosion damage. It appears to do too little damage in certain scenarios such as with the trigger quickly moving instead of sitting still and/or crawling up to a player.

Warper:
-Give players warped blast protection 2 to their chestplate for 3 seconds then revert to normal when those players are warped. Players need this to help mitigate coordinated attacks with explosive. This kit is honestly strong already as you can pull players into unfavorable situations for them. This will be an additive enchant so it won’t remove prot 1 or anything like that. For Pyro give them blast protection 3 so they get some buff. For juggernaut do not give them blast protection, they already have damage reduction on top of being tanky. For dwarf do not give them blast protection for a similar reason.

Marine:
-Slightly reduce bonus damage in water, it’s like having a sharp 1 or 2 diamond sword I forget the exact damage. This kit already has insane mobility in water and it’s only good on 1 or 2 maps, but it can be oppressive on those maps.

Venom:
-Apply sweeping edge 1 on the sword so it can do a small amount of aoe poison damage which can allow it to apply more anti healing effects.


Overall Suggestions:
-See damage dealt to other players in kill log, this will help players understand situations and interactions better.
-Have a gui to see what kits players are going. Gui will show spy and skinner as trooper. Also no names will be associated with the kits and neither will teams be visible.
-Give more time to SnD lobby but reduce map wait time, also allow players to /team color while in SnD lobby
-Give a /event command that displays a description of the current event, how long it lasts, and what you can get (including what are the limited time items).
 
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Hippydew

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Jul 17, 2020
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Using my phone (plus it being around 3:50am) so sorry in advance for typos. Anyways, I agree with most of this. I ESPECIALLY agree with all of the overall suggestions. I like the idea of having a better to read/understand kill log. Only one I’m iffy on is the whole GUI for seeing who is going what kit, especially if let’s say for example someone’s going spy, even though I assume you might have an idea for that. Kits wise let’s see.. I agree with everything said in the medic (except for the GUI thing), Spy, trigger, explosive, NINJA (being super fragile right now), venom, and marine sections. I do like the warped idea as well giving blast protection, it is super oppressive in situations and could definitely use some kind of... wouldn’t say nerf but... more counter play?

I also agree jugg and dwarf are both a bit uh, too tanky with I’d say a bit too much firepower with them. Dwarf is kind of a weird situation but I agree both of them shouldn’t be able to go straight into a fight via teleporter. That being said though, it is very rare to see it played/executed perfectly like that, it’s a weird situation but I do agree it is a bit of a nuisance. No input on porcupine since I don’t see it played really or never really played it myself. I think Burst could use maybe a small nerf if anything at all. I personally haven’t ran into many problems facing it recently when it comes across. I kinda thought Arbalist was a bit underwhelming playing it but i could understand the use of a cool down on the spectral arrow. And def fix the bug.

So the whole barricader thing is uh, hm, I like the idea? But I really couldn’t imagine how much it’ll affect gameplay, positively or negatively, I have no clue. It would be something that would be nice to look at though to be honest.

uh, I’m pretty sure I hit everything but overall.. I agree with a lot of it... I mean, people might over look it but that’s because they don’t realize that even little changes like these could help balance out the kits and game in general. My opinion(s) though of course.
 

Setery

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May 29, 2020
Messages
139
Using my phone (plus it being around 3:50am) so sorry in advance for typos. Anyways, I agree with most of this. I ESPECIALLY agree with all of the overall suggestions. I like the idea of having a better to read/understand kill log. Only one I’m iffy on is the whole GUI for seeing who is going what kit, especially if let’s say for example someone’s going spy, even though I assume you might have an idea for that. Kits wise let’s see.. I agree with everything said in the medic (except for the GUI thing), Spy, trigger, explosive, NINJA (being super fragile right now), venom, and marine sections. I do like the warped idea as well giving blast protection, it is super oppressive in situations and could definitely use some kind of... wouldn’t say nerf but... more counter play?

I also agree jugg and dwarf are both a bit uh, too tanky with I’d say a bit too much firepower with them. Dwarf is kind of a weird situation but I agree both of them shouldn’t be able to go straight into a fight via teleporter. That being said though, it is very rare to see it played/executed perfectly like that, it’s a weird situation but I do agree it is a bit of a nuisance. No input on porcupine since I don’t see it played really or never really played it myself. I think Burst could use maybe a small nerf if anything at all. I personally haven’t ran into many problems facing it recently when it comes across. I kinda thought Arbalist was a bit underwhelming playing it but i could understand the use of a cool down on the spectral arrow. And def fix the bug.

So the whole barricader thing is uh, hm, I like the idea? But I really couldn’t imagine how much it’ll affect gameplay, positively or negatively, I have no clue. It would be something that would be nice to look at though to be honest.

uh, I’m pretty sure I hit everything but overall.. I agree with a lot of it... I mean, people might over look it but that’s because they don’t realize that even little changes like these could help balance out the kits and game in general. My opinion(s) though of course.
Yeah should have gone further into what the gui would show and I’ll update the thread after this. Gui will show spy and skinner as trooper. Also no names will be associated with the kits and neither will teams be visible.
 

joshuanp

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Oct 16, 2020
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Here are my opinions on what you mentioned.

Medic:
-I agree that medics can definitely tilt a game, however playing medic is like putting a huge target on your head, it’s a very risky choice with a large reward.
-I don’t play medic enough to comment on how much healing it should be able to do without having to recharge compared to what it is right now.
-Your idea of a GUI to see peoples kits before the game starts, while interesting, I think it would take out a large bit of the randomness of the game, which is what keeps me playing so much. Maybe that’s just me, but probably not. If anything, only being able to see your teammates kits in the 10 seconds before start and not the enemies could be interesting. But I’m still unsure about that as well.
-Further reducing healing to jugg and dwarf might be a good idea, but their lack of mobility also might already make it balanced. It also depends on the situation of the matchup, if someone is able to go around and get the med, split them up, what can either jugg or dwarf do? But of all the ideas about medic, this might be the best to test out.
-Extra: The one thing about medic that I don’t understand is its iron sword. It’s an extremely effective kit for healing teammates health and it’s supposed to stay out of direct combat, so why does it have an iron sword? I think medic should take after paladin and just have a stone sword.

Arbalist:
-I personally don’t see much of a problem with arb. It can be very good in some situations and terrible in others. I think it’s balanced as is.

Burst:
-The only thing about burst I find to be a problem is the explosion damage from spammed arrows. It should be minimal explosion damage from spammed arrows and increase to max with full charge. That would be a good enough fix to the kit.

Dwarf:
-As it is right now, dwarf is hardly a viable kit. It relies on games being dragged out and 95% of current games end way too soon for dwarf to be useful. Any warper dwarf strategy likely rids two players from the team, which is more of a detriment than the strategy is worth. Honestly, I don’t think there’s anything that can be done to make dwarf a viable kit that doesn’t completely change it. The games are just too small and short, so I would have no problem with it being removed. Maybe reintroduce it if the server grows but it’s just a meh kit currently.

Juggernaut:
-Honestly, the tele jugg strategy is one of the only things that makes this kit viable. But that requires pulling it off. It’s hard to handle a 2v1 with strong melee kits, it can’t fight any bow kit whatsoever, it’s easy to stop a jugg disarming a bomb as invis kits, venom and warper are also good counters. As it is right now, I find jugg to be weak. The one time it truly shines is when it’s defending the enemy teams armed bomb, otherwise it’s just an annoyance. So a tele jugg nerf of any sort would ruin an already weak kit, imo.

Ninja:
-Ninja is an extremely versatile kit as it is, it counters every bow kit with ease. It can chase down and kill any low opponent. You can get very good combos with the speed. The 6 pearls save it from void and fall deaths while still being able to choose who you’re going to attack and who to run from. There are so many possible uses of the kit, that any buff to it would make it way to over powered. As it is right now, it requires skill to use very well, but if you get it down it’s a hard force to be reckoned with for any matchup.

Trigger:
-Trigger is very strong melee wise, with also a strong and risky ability. If one get’s skilled with trigger, it is very hard to fight. From what I’ve played as trigger, I don’t see any problems with the kit

Warper:
-For any warper/explo/trigger strategy, it requires stealth. You have to be in a perfect place where you can quickly get to players without being noticed, and only then will this combo work. In theory, this can be overpowered, but in practice, it is hard to actually pull off. What typically happens is your team dies because it’s at least -2 players from the other team, then you have a last second effort to warp people that have spotted you and ran away, leaving your strategy null and void and you lose. Pulling this off is very hard, but the possible reward could be a clutch. If there’s blast protection 2, well good luck clutching that game because you may have caused your team to lose anyways.

Marine:
-Eh, considering it’s only very strong in a couple of maps, and can also easily be countered by shortbow/people not in water, I don’t think this kit needs a nerf.

Venom:
-Considering venom is already a good kit, with a great hit and run strategy and being able to nullify effects of medic, any buff like this to it would make it overpowered.

Extra kit suggestions:
Porcupine:
-Right now porc is terrible. The main ability of it doing increasing damage to bow kits is underpowered. It only works against shortbow, longbow, and pyro since arb and wraith have piercing. It’s a very interesting idea doing increased damage by the number of arrows it’s been hit with but it just takes too long to truly do anything major, and by that time it’s probably died from melee.
-Porc can’t effectively melee anyone due to the invulnerability frames its thorns gives to the other player. I suggest either giving porc an iron sword with sharpness 1 to raise its small chances or custom coding the thorns to not damage any melee hits and only bow hits.
-Wraith and arb should also take increased damage from porc
-I believe with work done on this kit, it can be viable in gameplay, but as it is right now it has much to improve on.

Wraith:
-Recently wraith was changed to have a piercing effect instead of regular arrows. I really like this idea, but in my gameplay of wraith, the fact that it no longer sticks arrows in invisible kits has killed me more than I’ve been able to make use of piercing. The easiest fix to this would be to go back to what it was with regular arrows. However, what I think would be the best fix is to keep the piercing but also have invisible kits be put arrows in them. I’m just not sure how easy this would be to implement.

Responses to the other suggestions:
-I would love to see damage dealt to other players, this would also give another reason to buy VIP, no reasons for this not to be added, imo.
-I responded to the GUI suggestion in my medic opinion
-I think there should be an even 45/45 split for lobby/map time. No to picking teams in lobby, being able to do team color in lobby could possibly cause too many issues for what it’s worth if it’s a 4 team map that is selected instead of 2 team, there’s also better things to work on than this.
-Personally haven’t felt the need for an event command, but why not, just low priority on this

Extra:
-The minute and a half waiting time in very small games is a bit much, it’d be nice to have a vote start command where if everyone votes it jumps to the 10 second period.

If anyone has any comments or questions, feel free to discuss them with me!


Edit: Forgot to reply to barricader suggestion
Barricader being a mapmaker only kit encourages people to make maps in the first place and it's a good reward for the hard work they put in. This should definitely just stay mapmaker only, even though I also wish I could play it.
 
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Mythless

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Completely agree with all the general suggestions, more QoL changes are always nice to have. For the kits: I don't really think I can comment on every one of them as I'm not too familiar with them to give some credible feedback, so for now I'll just talk about two kits in particular:

MEDIC

What you explained regarding the medic disadvantage makes sense logically. The presence of just one healer who is able to quickly recover multiple allies' health even when near death is practically almost a surefire win when they stay in a group of at least 2 melee-focused kits and just focus on their job. The GUI suggestion is cool to know for planning to counter medic strats, but in actual practice it's almost always difficult to execute it when the medic with good teammates has meat shields covering most of their sides. So I agree on both the reduction to overall healing and reduction to tanky kits.

Another suggestion I think would be a nerf to having multiple medics on the same team. My version of this nerf would be a "shared healing pool"—having more than 1 medic on the same team increases the maximum capacity of the medic's energy pool proportionate to the amount of medics on the team (probably around 20%~40% would be a good amount), but the caveat is every medic will share the same energy pool. In theory, this will lead to less situations where a group of players will be basically unstoppable due to a cycle of one medic using up their heals while the other waits in reserve to tag in after that medic's energy pool is drained; or multiple medics acting simultaneously to out-heal any sort of damage the group receives. I like to think of this as tweaking the way multi-medic teams operate from "additional healing sources" to "additional healing opportunities" if that makes sense. Not quite sure this is good gameplay wise—this was just the first idea that came to my head.

ARBALIST

As someone who only plays this kit plays this kit for most of the time, I can give my two cents on this with slight confidence. As it stands right now, I feel Arbalist doesn't really need a cooldown increase at all, it's in a pretty good spot balance-wise. The reasons behind it stems from the kit offsetting itself for the potentially high damage output you mention.

For one, it has a... peculiar learning curve to perform consistently well. This is mainly because of the crossbow's mechanics and how weird its arrow trajectory works in SnD specifically. I would go so far as to say this particular kit is even difficult for skilled bow users to master because of how different its controls, shooting velocity, and strategies are; I've seen very few games where multiple arbys on the same team makes a difference between a win and a loss because of the aforementioned points. There's also the fact that it's more geared as a hybrid offense-support kit rather than a pure offense or pure support kit; role versatility/flexibility comes at the cost of specialized effectiveness, and this kit is no exception to that rule. At the very most, its ability to deal high damage is restricted to currently marked targets, which most of the time is 1~2 specific players that the user then has to focus on to get the most out of the opportunity. So its ability to pressure enemies via raw damage is really limiting actually.

The other thing though—the lingering spectral bug—PLEASE FIX IT. Not only does it prove to be unfair to invisible kits especially and just be granted free ESP, but it's also very hard to tell if those enemies are marked or not when fighting them. Sometimes when the bug occurs, I think an enemy is marked, but then fail to notice they're taking the normal amount of damage.
 
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Lexplosion

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May 25, 2020
Messages
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Explosive:
-Reduce the number of grenades that the player can throw out at once. I currently don’t know the number that they can use, please enlighten me so I can give a solid number to this.
-Lower close range RPG damage *or* heavily punish the explosive, as in more damage to the user, if they use an RPG very close to their body. I personally prefer the first over the second as players won’t be punished as hard for approaching a mostly ranged kit and entering close range. It’s very common to see explosives on 25% of their health RPGing last second and somehow still living and getting the kill.
You can throw 5 grenades in 5 seconds, then its on a cooldown for 5 seconds. Also rpg's do over half your health if it directly impacts you
 

Woaxa

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Thank you for making a large post

Medic: I fully support making the pool less and having more thought put into who and when you're healing rather than just anyone that's damaged whenever you have energy.

Arbalist: Myth is entirely right Arbalist is in a really good spot rn I don't see the need for any change besides the lingering spectral effect.

Barricader: I don't really see the point of nerfing it and I'm also not a fan of taking it down from mapmaker only. Although when the block change was first implemented I thought it was maybe a few too many but I'm unsure how I feel about that now. I'd personally say do nothing with it, no one uses it enough currently to be able to really tell how effective it is. Any camping team with a barri you have to question if the barri really makes a big enough difference on its own, the only map it has a major performance impact on is Chinas Heaven since breaking them while on the ladder is super slow. (Also Berserker insta breaks barricades)

Burst: Burst big dumb, being rewarded for not being accurate is a concept I don't personally like. Being able to spam high damage arrows while not being accurate just doesn't really work together. Like josh said and which has been talked about before, having the arrows scale with the bow charge would be an interesting change.

Dwarf: Although I believe Dwarf is next up on the chopping block I'd prefer for it's levels to be scaled differently instead. Faster leveling/deleveling, I'm not entirely sure what the max level is rn as you can't reach it before poison but honestly even doing something as drastic as halving it. Giving the kit the idea of choosing where to become an unstoppable force. As it is right now dwarf levels up once every 10 seconds. It gains sharp 1 at level 3, so 30 seconds into the game it matches a trooper with no gapples and slowness. With how slow this system is once the dwarf crouches they're dedicated to being in that spot the whole game. The slowness it gains is extremely punishing and doesn't allow any movement while still taking a ton of knockback. Making it 5 seconds per level is a good start to making it a more fun and active kit.

On the note of strategies, I think they're great, combing kits effects to make a devastating combo is fun and SnD being more of a party game than anything competitive I think they have their place but sending a prot 4 sharp 5 dwarf across the map can seem a little cheesy. With perfect coordination the tp can't be remote access the Teleporter would need to directly put themself in danger to instantly teleport the friendly Dwarf right into action, even being away by 5-8 blocks would make the Dwarf essentially useless. I do think even under those circumstances it can be accomplished fairly easy. Even then I'd still like it to remain the same. BUT if the levels get changed I would vibe with dwarfs only being able to teleport if they have 0 levels.

Dwarf Levels - lvl 3 (sharp 1) - lvl 6 (prot 1 sharp 2) - lvl 8 (prot 1 blast prot 1 sharp 2) - lvl 9 (sharp 3) -
lvl 12 (prot 2 blast prot 1 sharp 4) - lvl 15 (prot 2 blast prot 1 sharp 5) - lvl 16 (prot 2 blast prot 2 sharp 5) -
lvl 18 (prot 3 blast prot 2 sharp 5) - (it does go higher I just didn't look into it that deeply)

Explosive: I may have an unpopular take here, but I am in the process of making a official unofficial kit guide/tier list and Explosive is very high on it for me. I believe Explosive is extremely strong with the super high damage output, arguably the best area control which in a team based objective game is very powerful, and essentially a free kill confirm on a timer, while having no true hard counter. If we're talking about true balance this kit does not align at all. Even then I don't believe there's much you can do to it that will nerf it without having it feel ultimately useless in battle. The RPG is definitely the part of the kit to target, nerfing the cooldown, total starting RPG's, or maybe the trajectory giving it much less range. I don't think giving it more self damage is the way to go, from my experience it already takes a ton and increasing it would only stop players that RPG themselves already leaving the experienced players unharmed.

Juggernaut: Another unpopular opinion. Maybe give Jugg slowness 1 along with no sprint, in it's current state its extremely tanky and its damage output is nothing to scoff at. Although it can't sprint it can keep up with kits inside it's range for an uncomfortable amount of time. Slowness 1 wouldn't really change anything except making it less punishing to try and attack it, the interactions with bow kits would be the same, it was never hitting those to begin with.

Ninja: Rewinding back to my kit guide/tier list ninja is another one high up on the list, it's impact is insane especially with the Shortbow nerf. Before a Shortbow could barely duel a ninja if it landed a full charge shot and traded melee hits, now I don't believe that's possible while even before pulling that stunt was not an easy task, a Ninja diving a Shortbow now is an automatic loss (As an avid Shortbow player I'm pretty sure this is the only interaction that the nerf had any real effect on, other TTK's stayed the same except an arrow or two for tankier kits which don't matter since you're not in melee range to begin with). It duels any archer with ease and can chase retreating enemies for easy kills and damage. Any buff to this kit would make it borderline overpowered.

Porcupine: I don't have many thoughts on Porcupine as it's core concept is entirely bugged by mojang currently. No real evidence as to if it's overpowered or underpowered stat wise. It'd be interesting to see some anti knockback aspect to it maybe similar to the effect of netherite armor. On to the fire resistance pots, I think they have no reason being in SnD and especially not by this kit.

Spy: Yeah that's just a bug lol, I'm pretty sure Martoph has stated he's tried? or trying? to fix? Either way it's definitely known and may just be a bit complicated. Of my knowledge it has been around for every iteration of SnD so I'm sure its much trickier to solve than it appears.

Trigger: I don't see trigger as being played just to try and bomb into a group of enemies, with a lot of protection and a really good sword it's a deadly fighter. Buffing the explosion side of the kit past what it is now is kinda stupid and takes away from the unique aspect of the kit.

Warper: This kit entirely relies on coordination or your teammates to see you and understand what you're going for. I said before I'm a big fan of teamwork but being essentially insta killed if you're caught off guard kinda sucks. A lot of obvious ones you can look out for like the attic on Keeps, lack of enemies and you hear that trapdoor while approaching means turn the fuck around. Being a melee kit in a lot of scenarios against a Warper you didn't know existed can mean an unstoppable death in a lot of cases. A cool idea I've thought of is to have a sort of ramp up for the wand similar to the Death Gods way of killing although not nearly as long, maybe only a second or two, at least giving you a slight chance of fighting off or getting away from the Warper. That's only a thought rn but I believe giving warped kits different buffs depending on the kit that gets warped just makes the concept of warping and getting warped too complicated.

Marine: I believe this kit is fine, it owns the water. If you don't want to get melted don't get in the water if you know ones around. It's the easiest thing to avoid.

Venom: I think Venom is fine as it is, a good solid kit. Not overpowered, not underpowered and can still have a good impact on battle. Sure it's not as strong as some other kits but constantly buffing everything to be stronger than each other is not what we should be aiming for.

Misc: QoL changes are nice, more detailed kill log may not be a top priority change but welcomed nonetheless.
I've never liked the idea of seeing what kits are being picked and from opinions I've heard of this discussion being had before a lot of people agree.
I see the change of removing/adding time to the lobby and map time as trivial. I like the times the way they are now.
I think the /event command is pointless, I believe this last update notes post was a bit lackluster, missing some changes and how some aspects of the event work. I believe a very brief description of the update should be listed on discord, major kit changes, maps, and if there's an event the general idea of it, then having a much more in detail post on the forums listing every change no matter how small.

Personal side note: I think it's been a long time coming for a /discord command or something similar to that.
 

Martoph

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Medic already has significantly lower rate of healing for the kits you mentioned...
As far as a GUI, it's not happening. It's been discussed before and it can't be implemented in a clean way.
As far as healing pool, could be something I look into.

The kit is supposed to do more damage the longer they charge their bow and the further away the shot is.
Is what you told me about burst in a bug report. Tell me again about where this was mentioned? Bug reports section is not for your personal opinions.

While I agree, this is not how I designed the kit. This is a whole separate suggestion. Do not label this as a bug when there is no documentation this being intended behavior. Would like to also see some sort of evidence of this happening...

You're basically asking to remove teamwork from the game. Until this becomes an issue for majority of games, I see no reason to change/nerf it. As far as end-game dwarf goes, I can see an issue there. But your solution is not very clean nor feels good for a player who is playing dwarf. Would like to see this adapted in a different way.

Porcupine:
Currently it's not worth to make any changes to porcupine at the moment, its completely broken just based on the fact it can't do damage with the hit-cooldown that was introduced in 1.16. Sad, as it worked swimmingly on 1.15.

Fix their name from appearing at the bottom of the team in tab.
This is actually impossible due to how scoreboard teams work with Mojang. Implementing a fix would sacrifice too much from other gameplay mechanics.

Trigger:
-Buff or fix explosion damage. It appears to do too little damage in certain scenarios such as with the trigger quickly moving instead of sitting still and/or crawling up to a player.
This is another one of your "there is a problem but i cannot provide evidence." I have played trigger, others have as well. You are the only one outspoken about this problem that you cannot verify.

Marine:
-Slightly reduce bonus damage in water, it’s like having a sharp 1 or 2 diamond sword I forget the exact damage. This kit already has insane mobility in water and it’s only good on 1 or 2 maps, but it can be oppressive on those maps.
Every map offers a land option. Use it if you feel threatened by a marine...

/team color while in SnD lobby
There's a very simple reason as to why this can't happen: how do you know what teams will exist in the lobby?

See damage dealt to other players in kill log, this will help players understand situations and interactions better.
Probably one of the better takes in this thread.

As far as everything else you mentioned, it's either too complex from a player perspective... or just doesn't need to happen at all. Suggestions should be simple and intuitive. While you may provide suggestions that make the game fair from a technical standpoint, they often lack intuitive sense from a player's perspective.
 
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Onett

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166
tbh I agree with a lot with what Woaxa said but with some nuance. I'll just post my opinions that differ from other people who've replied so far or just some things to add on to what's been said.

Medic: Medic's healing needs a nerf, but I think I'd prefer slower healing rate rather than reduced heal pool in order to prevent accidently depleting your heal pool too fast.

Explosive: I think Pika made a good suggestion for explosive and AoE kits in general:
https://athiosmc.com/threads/reducing-the-oppressiveness-of-explosions.293/
TL;DR if you take explosive damage from different enemies, the damage you take is slightly reduced, which scales temporarily.

Juggernaut: This kit should have a wood sword imo. I think nerfing its movement would cripple it too hard as it wouldn't be able to chase people at all and it wouldn't be able to move from bomb to bomb fast enough. Its current move speed allows it to catch people out of position and punish them which is kind of a staple of the kit imo.

Ninja: I disagree with what you guys have said so far about this kit, I think some form of self sustain is needed. It does have a favorable match up against archers, but if you find yourself 1v1ing an archer it will still leave you on low HP often, in which your only option is to afk wait for natural regen to heal back up if you don't have a medic.

Outside of 1v1 interactions picking people off is not as easy as it seems, and you'll take a lot of damage trying to kill a fragile enemy like a medic or pyro, since its rare to see someone completely isolated from their team, especially if they are a kit that can get picked off easily.

This buff is mainly concerned with just letting the ninja player be more active instead of forcing them to attack then hide until they regen, then come back out. Regen 1 is very slow healing and will not effect its ability to fight. Considering the fact that I don't see people really bothered by the medic + ninja combo I don't see how giving it a little self healing would make it OP.

Porc: I like the idea of reduced kb taken, this kit definitely needs a buff since it feels like paladin does a better job of being an arrow tank. I think rescaling the thorns return damage to be stronger would be a good idea. I made a thread about it earlier but scaling the thorns damage up to 100% and starting at a higher base % reflection would help make its damage reflect ability actually useful and it could also possibly help counter explosive and burst too which are kits that people in this thread seem to have issues with. Not a hard fix but it would introduce some counter play.

also almost instakilling demos by stepping on their mines would be pretty funny

Warper: I like Woaxa's suggestion for the kit, its definitely a step into the right direction. I don't think a death god type of charge up would be good, since it's pretty easy for someone to knock you out of range if you are chasing them.

Instead, maybe it should right click to initiate the 1 or 2 second charge up then warp anyone within an AoE around the player. Once the warp is initiated it can't be cancelled, also AoE would be like 5/6 blocks. There would also be some type of indicator to show that the warper initiated the warp. If no one is warped, you don't lose the ability charge.

Not completely sure about this idea though
 

Setery

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Medic already has significantly lower rate of healing for the kits you mentioned...
As far as a GUI, it's not happening. It's been discussed before and it can't be implemented in a clean way.
As far as healing pool, could be something I look into.


Is what you told me about burst in a bug report. Tell me again about where this was mentioned? Bug reports section is not for your personal opinions.

While I agree, this is not how I designed the kit. This is a whole separate suggestion. Do not label this as a bug when there is no documentation this being intended behavior. Would like to also see some sort of evidence of this happening...


You're basically asking to remove teamwork from the game. Until this becomes an issue for majority of games, I see no reason to change/nerf it. As far as end-game dwarf goes, I can see an issue there. But your solution is not very clean nor feels good for a player who is playing dwarf. Would like to see this adapted in a different way.


Currently it's not worth to make any changes to porcupine at the moment, its completely broken just based on the fact it can't do damage with the hit-cooldown that was introduced in 1.16. Sad, as it worked swimmingly on 1.15.


This is actually impossible due to how scoreboard teams work with Mojang. Implementing a fix would sacrifice too much from other gameplay mechanics.


This is another one of your "there is a problem but i cannot provide evidence." I have played trigger, others have as well. You are the only one outspoken about this problem that you cannot verify.


Every map offers a land option. Use it if you feel threatened by a marine...


There's a very simple reason as to why this can't happen: how do you know what teams will exist in the lobby?


Probably one of the better takes in this thread.

As far as everything else you mentioned, it's either too complex from a player perspective... or just doesn't need to happen at all. Suggestions should be simple and intuitive. While you may provide suggestions that make the game fair from a technical standpoint, they often lack intuitive sense from a player's perspective.
I'll get to replying to the rest in a bit, but wanted to address burst really quickly so people don't get a misunderstanding:
https://athiosmc.com/threads/back-to-school-update.279/
1603567690136.png
This wasn't my "opinion" this was an actual change that supposedly went through to address burst.

Onto the rest of my response:
-Still think an even lower rate of healing would be good for medic
-I don't want to remove teamwork with dwarf, I just think this class makes the game go to a horribly slow pace and makes approaching extremely risky and without some change to dwarf, this will remain that way. Nobody likes stalled out games going to poison.
-I can't verify that 1.16 did anything to porcupine, maybe it just needs an overhaul
-Edit: Porcupine in fact was never in 1.15 on the main server, I'm confused at your comparison. (https://athiosmc.com/threads/athios-now-on-1-16.230/)
-If spy can't be fixed then it will likely only get 1 or 2 kills for a game or 2 then be hard countered after that.
-I simply do not wish to play trigger in the state it's in. This is more of a situation where you have to believe me and test it out with your staff. The faster a trigger is moving the more delayed the explosion is to their location.
-Every map *does* offer a land option but there are maps like tropical resorts where it's literally all risk to go to mid no matter how you approach mid. There's simply not enough land. This can be mitigated if the map gets a slight update. I don't mind if Marine has one really solid map, but I don't like the idea of balancing a kit based on that one map situation and then ruling it out entirely.
-You can simply have the map chosen prior to actually switching to the map, this would allow players to do /team red and the name of the map could be displayed too.
 
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Pandu

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Ninja:
-Ninja is an extremely powerful kit as it is, it counters every bow kit with ease. It can chase down and kill any low opponent. You can get very good combos with the speed. The 6 pearls save it from void and fall deaths while still being able to choose who you’re going to attack and who to run from. There are so many possible uses of the kit, that any buff to it would make it way to over powered. As it is right now, it requires skill to use very well, but if you get it down it’s a hard force to be reckoned with for any matchup.
1603571111257.png
 

Setery

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Here are my opinions on what you mentioned.

Medic:
-I agree that medics can definitely tilt a game, however playing medic is like putting a huge target on your head, it’s a very risky choice with a large reward.
-I don’t play medic enough to comment on how much healing it should be able to do without having to recharge compared to what it is right now.
-Your idea of a GUI to see peoples kits before the game starts, while interesting, I think it would take out a large bit of the randomness of the game, which is what keeps me playing so much. Maybe that’s just me, but probably not. If anything, only being able to see your teammates kits in the 10 seconds before start and not the enemies could be interesting. But I’m still unsure about that as well.
-Further reducing healing to jugg and dwarf might be a good idea, but their lack of mobility also might already make it balanced. It also depends on the situation of the matchup, if someone is able to go around and get the med, split them up, what can either jugg or dwarf do? But of all the ideas about medic, this might be the best to test out.
-Extra: The one thing about medic that I don’t understand is its iron sword. It’s an extremely effective kit for healing teammates health and it’s supposed to stay out of direct combat, so why does it have an iron sword? I think medic should take after paladin and just have a stone sword.

Arbalist:
-I personally don’t see much of a problem with arb. It can be very good in some situations and terrible in others. I think it’s balanced as is.

Burst:
-The only thing about burst I find to be a problem is the explosion damage from spammed arrows. It should be minimal explosion damage from spammed arrows and increase to max with full charge. That would be a good enough fix to the kit.

Dwarf:
-As it is right now, dwarf is hardly a viable kit. It relies on games being dragged out and 95% of current games end way too soon for dwarf to be useful. Any warper dwarf strategy likely rids two players from the team, which is more of a detriment than the strategy is worth. Honestly, I don’t think there’s anything that can be done to make dwarf a viable kit that doesn’t completely change it. The games are just too small and short, so I would have no problem with it being removed. Maybe reintroduce it if the server grows but it’s just a meh kit currently.

Juggernaut:
-Honestly, the tele jugg strategy is one of the only things that makes this kit viable. But that requires pulling it off. It’s hard to handle a 2v1 with strong melee kits, it can’t fight any bow kit whatsoever, it’s easy to stop a jugg disarming a bomb as invis kits, venom and warper are also good counters. As it is right now, I find jugg to be weak. The one time it truly shines is when it’s defending the enemy teams armed bomb, otherwise it’s just an annoyance. So a tele jugg nerf of any sort would ruin an already weak kit, imo.

Ninja:
-Ninja is an extremely powerful kit as it is, it counters every bow kit with ease. It can chase down and kill any low opponent. You can get very good combos with the speed. The 6 pearls save it from void and fall deaths while still being able to choose who you’re going to attack and who to run from. There are so many possible uses of the kit, that any buff to it would make it way to over powered. As it is right now, it requires skill to use very well, but if you get it down it’s a hard force to be reckoned with for any matchup.

Trigger:
-Trigger is very strong melee wise, with also a strong and risky ability. If one get’s skilled with trigger, it is very hard to fight. From what I’ve played as trigger, I don’t see any problems with the kit

Warper:
-For any warper/explo/trigger strategy, it requires stealth. You have to be in a perfect place where you can quickly get to players without being noticed, and only then will this combo work. In theory, this can be overpowered, but in practice, it is hard to actually pull off. What typically happens is your team dies because it’s at least -2 players from the other team, then you have a last second effort to warp people that have spotted you and ran away, leaving your strategy null and void and you lose. Pulling this off is very hard, but the possible reward could be a clutch. If there’s blast protection 2, well good luck clutching that game because you may have caused your team to lose anyways.

Marine:
-Eh, considering it’s only very strong in a couple of maps, and can also easily be countered by shortbow/people not in water, I don’t think this kit needs a nerf.

Venom:
-Considering venom is already a good kit, with a great hit and run strategy and being able to nullify effects of medic, any buff like this to it would make it overpowered.

Extra kit suggestions:
Porcupine:
-Right now porc is terrible. The main ability of it doing increasing damage to bow kits is underpowered. It only works against shortbow, longbow, and pyro since arb and wraith have piercing. It’s a very interesting idea doing increased damage by the number of arrows it’s been hit with but it just takes too long to truly do anything major, and by that time it’s probably died from melee.
-Porc can’t effectively melee anyone due to the invulnerability frames its thorns gives to the other player. I suggest either giving porc an iron sword with sharpness 1 to raise its small chances or custom coding the thorns to not damage any melee hits and only bow hits.
-Wraith and arb should also take increased damage from porc
-I believe with work done on this kit, it can be viable in gameplay, but as it is right now it has much to improve on.

Wraith:
-Recently wraith was changed to have a piercing effect instead of regular arrows. I really like this idea, but in my gameplay of wraith, the fact that it no longer sticks arrows in invisible kits has killed me more than I’ve been able to make use of piercing. The easiest fix to this would be to go back to what it was with regular arrows. However, what I think would be the best fix is to keep the piercing but also have invisible kits be put arrows in them. I’m just not sure how easy this would be to implement.

Responses to the other suggestions:
-I would love to see damage dealt to other players, this would also give another reason to buy VIP, no reasons for this not to be added, imo.
-I responded to the GUI suggestion in my medic opinion
-I think there should be an even 45/45 split for lobby/map time. No to picking teams in lobby, being able to do team color in lobby could possibly cause too many issues for what it’s worth if it’s a 4 team map that is selected instead of 2 team, there’s also better things to work on than this.
-Personally haven’t felt the need for an event command, but why not, just low priority on this

Extra:
-The minute and a half waiting time in very small games is a bit much, it’d be nice to have a vote start command where if everyone votes it jumps to the 10 second period.

If anyone has any comments or questions, feel free to discuss them with me!


Edit: Forgot to reply to barricader suggestion
Barricader being a mapmaker only kit encourages people to make maps in the first place and it's a good reward for the hard work they put in. This should definitely just stay mapmaker only, even though I also wish I could play it.
-Yes dwarf isn't a viable kit, but it still ruins the fun of other players by simply sitting in one spot. I think punishing the dwarf is reasonable.
-Jugg is viable without teleporter, it's just that these combos are just too strong.
-Ninja is certainly not an op kit, I agree pretty much with what Onett_ said. Pretty much only good pvp players play this kit, combos are nearly nonexistent. The only kills you get with this kit is with people being way out of position or from picking off low health players. Generally speaking this kit loses to almost all of the melee kits in a 1v1.
-Trigger is just straight up bugged in my opinion from playing it. The damage from the explosion doesn't seem to be working properly. I didn't suggest anything about buffing the kit, just fixing.
-Warper generally doesn't require stealth, all you do is simply chase someone down to combo them into your team. If you have a bad warp, it's simply a bad warp. Any kit can have a bad play.
-Marine may not need a nerf, maybe a map fix on some of their oppressive maps.
-Venom is a semi good kit, I wouldn't put it on the same tier as a bow or trooper kit. It's not terrible it's just in an ok state. I think sweeping edge 1 will give it that slight nudge it needs.

-Onto medic: Yes medic is a massive target because of their potential to decide a game. It's clearly targeted because it's one of the strongest kits, not simply because the armor is weaker than a melee kit. Ghosts will target archers because of their damage and range potential not because their armor is slightly weaker than a trooper. Same theory applies to medic.
 

Setery

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Completely agree with all the general suggestions, more QoL changes are always nice to have. For the kits: I don't really think I can comment on every one of them as I'm not too familiar with them to give some credible feedback, so for now I'll just talk about two kits in particular:

MEDIC

What you explained regarding the medic disadvantage makes sense logically. The presence of just one healer who is able to quickly recover multiple allies' health even when near death is practically almost a surefire win when they stay in a group of at least 2 melee-focused kits and just focus on their job. The GUI suggestion is cool to know for planning to counter medic strats, but in actual practice it's almost always difficult to execute it when the medic with good teammates has meat shields covering most of their sides. So I agree on both the reduction to overall healing and reduction to tanky kits.

Another suggestion I think would be a nerf to having multiple medics on the same team. My version of this nerf would be a "shared healing pool"—having more than 1 medic on the same team increases the maximum capacity of the medic's energy pool proportionate to the amount of medics on the team (probably around 20%~40% would be a good amount), but the caveat is every medic will share the same energy pool. In theory, this will lead to less situations where a group of players will be basically unstoppable due to a cycle of one medic using up their heals while the other waits in reserve to tag in after that medic's energy pool is drained; or multiple medics acting simultaneously to out-heal any sort of damage the group receives. I like to think of this as tweaking the way multi-medic teams operate from "additional healing sources" to "additional healing opportunities" if that makes sense. Not quite sure this is good gameplay wise—this was just the first idea that came to my head.

ARBALIST

As someone who only plays this kit plays this kit for most of the time, I can give my two cents on this with slight confidence. As it stands right now, I feel Arbalist doesn't really need a cooldown increase at all, it's in a pretty good spot balance-wise. The reasons behind it stems from the kit offsetting itself for the potentially high damage output you mention.

For one, it has a... peculiar learning curve to perform consistently well. This is mainly because of the crossbow's mechanics and how weird its arrow trajectory works in SnD specifically. I would go so far as to say this particular kit is even difficult for skilled bow users to master because of how different its controls, shooting velocity, and strategies are; I've seen very few games where multiple arbys on the same team makes a difference between a win and a loss because of the aforementioned points. There's also the fact that it's more geared as a hybrid offense-support kit rather than a pure offense or pure support kit; role versatility/flexibility comes at the cost of specialized effectiveness, and this kit is no exception to that rule. At the very most, its ability to deal high damage is restricted to currently marked targets, which most of the time is 1~2 specific players that the user then has to focus on to get the most out of the opportunity. So its ability to pressure enemies via raw damage is really limiting actually.

The other thing though—the lingering spectral bug—PLEASE FIX IT. Not only does it prove to be unfair to invisible kits especially and just be granted free ESP, but it's also very hard to tell if those enemies are marked or not when fighting them. Sometimes when the bug occurs, I think an enemy is marked, but then fail to notice they're taking the normal amount of damage.
I like the shared healing pool, but there may still be scenarios such as with 8v8 games where 1 medic can effectively tilt the outcome heavily.
 

Setery

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Thank you for making a large post
(had to cut off your quote to make my response)

The reason I ask for the change of barricader is that the general response to nerfing the kit is: "It's mapmaker exclusive, it's fine no one hardly plays it" Well there's two reasons that argument is null. There are more mapmakers than ever, if you see a game with like 6-8 of them online, chances are at least 1 or 2 are going barricader, that's just how it is. Second reason, calling a kit balanced based on the limited use of it is wrong. If we had a kit called Trooper 2.0 that is just trooper with a crate at the start, but only 1 person could use it at a time, no one would call that kit fair. This is obviously an exaggeration but I think you get my point.

I think dwarf needs at least some change, it doesn't have to be my idea (I personally don't care about those sort of things), it just needs to stop being the reason people leave 40 player games. Not a single player wants to wait until poison because no team can reasonably approach with the dwarf camping all game.

Slowness 1 on jugg may be the more sensible change

Ninja doesn't really pick off and win fights against archers unless they got shot at a few times and Ninja goes in for the clean, or if the archer is off by itself. Those scenarios are honestly understandable. I'll sort of repeat what Onett said and what I said in another response. Combos are nearly nonexistant now, only if you get lucky or have good ping will you really ever get one. Back in 1.8 I would agree that it stood a chance against melee kits, but now you trade hits and it doesn't really work that way.

Porcupine might be bugged by Mojang I don't really know to the extent of what's going on. But I will say that this kit came with the launch of 1.16 for the server. Therefore, it's reasonable to say that this kit has been bugged for 3.5 months with nothing to address this problem.

If someone can come up with an interesting fix for spy, then that would be cool.

I didn't ask for trigger to be buffed, simply bug fixed. There are ways you can buff this kit, but I don't want to address those until the kit gets fixed.

I think that warper change would need some playtesting to see how it would actually play out, it could work though.

Venom I believe was designed to be a support melee kit, and since it can cut off healing, this kit has potential to be really useful. Due to the armor it's only allowed around 2-3 hits before it needs to back off in a group fight, otherwise it will simply die. Having sweeping edge would allow it to apply the poison and anti heal debuff, the bonus damage from sweeping edge is extremely minor and likely wouldn't even deal half a heart to the majority of kits. Not to mention it could inturrupt damage frames, the sole reason is to apply the debuffs.

At the very least a /event command could link you to the thread regarding the event
 

Setery

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Messages
139
tbh I agree with a lot with what Woaxa said but with some nuance. I'll just post my opinions that differ from other people who've replied so far or just some things to add on to what's been said.

Medic: Medic's healing needs a nerf, but I think I'd prefer slower healing rate rather than reduced heal pool in order to prevent accidently depleting your heal pool too fast.

Explosive: I think Pika made a good suggestion for explosive and AoE kits in general:
https://athiosmc.com/threads/reducing-the-oppressiveness-of-explosions.293/
TL;DR if you take explosive damage from different enemies, the damage you take is slightly reduced, which scales temporarily.

Juggernaut: This kit should have a wood sword imo. I think nerfing its movement would cripple it too hard as it wouldn't be able to chase people at all and it wouldn't be able to move from bomb to bomb fast enough. Its current move speed allows it to catch people out of position and punish them which is kind of a staple of the kit imo.

Ninja: I disagree with what you guys have said so far about this kit, I think some form of self sustain is needed. It does have a favorable match up against archers, but if you find yourself 1v1ing an archer it will still leave you on low HP often, in which your only option is to afk wait for natural regen to heal back up if you don't have a medic.

Outside of 1v1 interactions picking people off is not as easy as it seems, and you'll take a lot of damage trying to kill a fragile enemy like a medic or pyro, since its rare to see someone completely isolated from their team, especially if they are a kit that can get picked off easily.

This buff is mainly concerned with just letting the ninja player be more active instead of forcing them to attack then hide until they regen, then come back out. Regen 1 is very slow healing and will not effect its ability to fight. Considering the fact that I don't see people really bothered by the medic + ninja combo I don't see how giving it a little self healing would make it OP.

Porc: I like the idea of reduced kb taken, this kit definitely needs a buff since it feels like paladin does a better job of being an arrow tank. I think rescaling the thorns return damage to be stronger would be a good idea. I made a thread about it earlier but scaling the thorns damage up to 100% and starting at a higher base % reflection would help make its damage reflect ability actually useful and it could also possibly help counter explosive and burst too which are kits that people in this thread seem to have issues with. Not a hard fix but it would introduce some counter play.

also almost instakilling demos by stepping on their mines would be pretty funny

Warper: I like Woaxa's suggestion for the kit, its definitely a step into the right direction. I don't think a death god type of charge up would be good, since it's pretty easy for someone to knock you out of range if you are chasing them.

Instead, maybe it should right click to initiate the 1 or 2 second charge up then warp anyone within an AoE around the player. Once the warp is initiated it can't be cancelled, also AoE would be like 5/6 blocks. There would also be some type of indicator to show that the warper initiated the warp. If no one is warped, you don't lose the ability charge.

Not completely sure about this idea though
Your suggestion on medic I agree with as well, either or would work imo.

I did like pika's suggestion, but I assumed that it was considered then not implemented since he posted it a while ago. I still think RPG needs a nerf though.

Wood sword may work

Perfect response to ninja, totally agree obviously
 

Setery

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Added burst to remove power 1 and added burst to the additionally lowered healing pool.
 

Woaxa

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Added burst to remove power 1 and added burst to the additionally lowered healing pool.
The "Power" enchant on burst doesn't actually do anything, and for your previous post I've done a LOT of testing with burst, in a very controlled environment. The sweet spot for best damage is the ground right next to the enemy. Directing the enemy causes very wacky numbers, the ground one block away gives the best results. Even with I'd say 500-600 burst shots replicating the insane like 3.5 heart shots to 60% armor was rare and we couldn't find any spot to get them anywhere near consistently.

To reply to your response to me, I didn't say Barricader was balanced because not a lot of people played it, I said since there's not a lot of people playing it there's no way to tell if it's unbalanced or not since it just doesn't get played enough.

I still think we have extremely varying opinion on Ninja, I think it's a big sleeper kit. Very very hard to play correctly but if you do it's extremely powerful.

As for Porcupine and the bug, it's to do with the damage invuln everyone has that was introduced in like 1.16.1? or 1.16.2? Let's you basically become invincible if you stand on a campfire, makes a lot of team fights pain, ruins pyro arrows denying repeat shots to the same target, and entirely breaking porcupine as a concept. Whatever it is I'm sure it is not as easy to fix on the surface or I believe we could have expected a fix by now.

Then I'll talk about Venom again with a real scenario that happened recently (less than a week ago?). It was two teams on Nevermore both had a fairly similar team comp, one medic each, good amount of fighters, and some archers, with maybe 8 players on each side?? The only major difference is one team had a venom (it was you!). While your team attacked my team, I attacked your medic and got the kill, your medic was barely able to heal. Our medic was one of the last people to die, but your team still won with a massive number advantage. Although I killed your medic near instantly denying their ability to heal. I believe you as a sole Venom entirely turned the fight denying the heals to a majority of my team. Giving it any sort of AoE would be overpowered imo.

Anything else you mentioned there's either nothing else to elaborate on or I fully stand by my original statement.
 

Setery

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The "Power" enchant on burst doesn't actually do anything, and for your previous post I've done a LOT of testing with burst, in a very controlled environment. The sweet spot for best damage is the ground right next to the enemy. Directing the enemy causes very wacky numbers, the ground one block away gives the best results. Even with I'd say 500-600 burst shots replicating the insane like 3.5 heart shots to 60% armor was rare and we couldn't find any spot to get them anywhere near consistently.

To reply to your response to me, I didn't say Barricader was balanced because not a lot of people played it, I said since there's not a lot of people playing it there's no way to tell if it's unbalanced or not since it just doesn't get played enough.

I still think we have extremely varying opinion on Ninja, I think it's a big sleeper kit. Very very hard to play correctly but if you do it's extremely powerful.

As for Porcupine and the bug, it's to do with the damage invuln everyone has that was introduced in like 1.16.1? or 1.16.2? Let's you basically become invincible if you stand on a campfire, makes a lot of team fights pain, ruins pyro arrows denying repeat shots to the same target, and entirely breaking porcupine as a concept. Whatever it is I'm sure it is not as easy to fix on the surface or I believe we could have expected a fix by now.

Then I'll talk about Venom again with a real scenario that happened recently (less than a week ago?). It was two teams on Nevermore both had a fairly similar team comp, one medic each, good amount of fighters, and some archers, with maybe 8 players on each side?? The only major difference is one team had a venom (it was you!). While your team attacked my team, I attacked your medic and got the kill, your medic was barely able to heal. Our medic was one of the last people to die, but your team still won with a massive number advantage. Although I killed your medic near instantly denying their ability to heal. I believe you as a sole Venom entirely turned the fight denying the heals to a majority of my team. Giving it any sort of AoE would be overpowered imo.

Anything else you mentioned there's either nothing else to elaborate on or I fully stand by my original statement.
I'm gonna be honest I have to play venom otherwise a single medic choice commonly rolls teams. I'm throwing out many ideas, if medic remains unchanged, we should buff venom. If medic changes, then sure hold off on touching venom. It's just that medic has too much of a presence on a game, venom is one of the only choices to at least stop that from happening.
1.14 Damage invulnerability frames. Damage invulnerability frames have been in the game forever, it was at least in beta. Now if these frames slightly changed, I can't really verify that, but in other servers they had issues with fire aspect cutting DPS in half because of this. They managed a work around and it's flawless.
 

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